Kia Optima Forums banner
1 - 20 of 39 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello, I was until this last Sunday a proud owner of a 2013 Kia Optima SXL.

On Sunday the engine seized suddenly while on the highway and I am left with a $7500 quote for a needed engine replacement and a dealership that says the issue isn’t covered by the settlements Lifetime warranty because the engine is not “knocking” and the code P1326 is not showing up.

I had the car towed to the dealership which I usually get service done at on Sunday, and they were not able to give me a diagnosis until Tuesday (yesterday). I have not been to the dealership yet because my work shift starts and ends outside of their business hours. I have not even seen the paperwork from the diagnosis, even though I requested it be emailed to me.

The explanation I got over the phone for what happened was: “a misfire breaking away at the value.”

I don’t know what this means. I also do not understand why engine seizure would not be covered but “knocking“ would be covered.

I am attaching a photo of the settlements description of the warranty. Can anyone illuminate this situation for me? Am I covered?

I spoke to Kia Corporate to ask for good will assurance. I am not optimistic that they are even interested in paying for this.

Background info: I am the only owner, I’ve never skipped maintenance in any fashion and I have only completed maintenance at the dealership. Less than 9 weeks ago I replaced the timing belt and spark plugs.

I have a 2013 Kia Optima SXL with130,009 miles.

I feel so stressed because this is my only car and I am pregnant this is a huge burden and challenge I was not expecting. Any insight will be so helpful, thanks in advance.

Link to the info I posted: Kia Engine Settlement

249648
 

·
Registered
2011 Kia Optima
Joined
·
3,375 Posts
If all updates have been done, the engine should be covered, but it seems as Kia/Hyundai has begun giving customers a difficult
time when engine problems arise. There is absolutely nothing stating that the KSDS code P1326 must be in history to guarantee
engine replacement, as that was only installed to ensure that if/when a knock was detected it would limit engine performance to
2000 rpm, and allow the driver to get to the dealership before the engine seized, but in reality, it doesn't always work as planned.
Only advice I can give, is that there should be no goodwill repair asked for, but be stern with Kia and tell them if they deny the recall,
you'll get NHTSA involved 1-888-327-4236, or maybe try NHTSA first.
Ask Kia to show you where, in the settlement, the CEL code P1326 is mandatory before the seized engine is replaced.
All that needs to be done is to have the KSDS update.

This is quite an about face for Kia, as in 2019 when I had the engine problems with the '11 2.0T, they were more than helpful and
replacement engine was done quickly.

Just one item, the car doesn't have a timing belt, so they probably replaced the serpentine belt. not a big deal, but wanted
clarification in case you use the info in the future.

Just wanted to add that I'd stay away from the goodwill repair as that would allow Kia to say they'll help with 50%(example) when
it should cost you nothing, as well as supplying a free loner car.

Also, the dealership leaves a lot to be desired, as having a loyal customer there was no reason to even bring up the CEL, they
should have just stated that the engine seized. Another stealership to steer clear of! Actually, I haven't found one yet that I would
recommend, and that's with dealing with 4. The only one that was decent, went out of business, so guess it pays to be dishonest
and put it to the customers, then they'll stay in business.

Keep us posted.
 

·
Registered
2018 Kia Optima
Joined
·
1,146 Posts
I'm with Turbonut on this one--unless you didn't have the KSDS update performed on your vehicle, Kia should replace your engine at no cost to you unless they can absolutely prove that the engine failure was a result of customer abuse and/or negligence.

Now OTOH if you didn't get the KSDS update done on your vehicle prior to the engine failure, then you're facing a much steeper hill to climb as far as getting Kia to replace your engine at no cost to you.

In any case, I hope the outcome turns out to be in your favor!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
If all updates have been done, the engine should be covered, but it seems as Kia/Hyundai has begun giving customers a difficult
time when engine problems arise. There is absolutely nothing stating that the KSDS code P1326 must be in history to guarantee
engine replacement, as that was only installed to ensure that if/when a knock was detected it would limit engine performance to
2000 rpm, and allow the driver to get to the dealership before the engine seized, but in reality, it doesn't always work as planned.
Only advice I can give, is that there should be no goodwill repair asked for, but be stern with Kia and tell them if they deny the recall,
you'll get NHTSA involved 1-888-327-4236, or maybe try NHTSA first.
Ask Kia to show you where, in the settlement, the CEL code P1326 is mandatory before the seized engine is replaced.
All that needs to be done is to have the KSDS update.

This is quite an about face for Kia, as in 2019 when I had the engine problems with the '11 2.0T, they were more than helpful and
replacement engine was done quickly.

Just one item, the car doesn't have a timing belt, so they probably replaced the serpentine belt. not a big deal, but wanted
clarification in case you use the info in the future.

Just wanted to add that I'd stay away from the goodwill repair as that would allow Kia to say they'll help with 50%(example) when
it should cost you nothing, as well as supplying a free loner car.

Also, the dealership leaves a lot to be desired, as having a loyal customer there was no reason to even bring up the CEL, they
should have just stated that the engine seized. Another stealership to steer clear of! Actually, I haven't found one yet that I would
recommend, and that's with dealing with 4. The only one that was decent, went out of business, so guess it pays to be dishonest
and put it to the customers, then they'll stay in business.

Keep us posted.
Thank you so much!!! Yes you’re absolutely right about the belt- serpentine not timing belt. And you’re right - I felt like a goodwill claim would be a ripoff to what I’m clearly entitled to. I got a call from the dealership today that Kia Corporate was getting in touch with them. I’ll accept the goodwill if it’s 100%. Otherwise I’ll just file a claim.


I wonder if the goodwill is a scam - like if I accept it then is it going to not be under the lifetime warranty when it otherwise would have.

I just don’t trust them anymore. When I spoke to someone at Kia Corporate to get an update yesterday the representative tried to convince me that there was no way to tell if my car is included in the settlement when I have already verified that it is with someone else. They are snakes!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I'm with Turbonut on this one--unless you didn't have the KSDS update performed on your vehicle, Kia should replace your engine at no cost to you unless they can absolutely prove that the engine failure was a result of customer abuse and/or negligence.

Now OTOH if you didn't get the KSDS update done on your vehicle prior to the engine failure, then you're facing a much steeper hill to climb as far as getting Kia to replace your engine at no cost to you.

In any case, I hope the outcome turns out to be in your favor!
I absolutely had that update so they can’t try that one on me! I will keep everyone updated so I will let y’all know what happens.
In the meantime, I would steer friends and family away from this company.
I feel they are out to make the least amount of loss they can manage and unfortunately I believe they will leave those who need the help the most behind with a serious loss.
 

·
Registered
2011 Kia Optima
Joined
·
3,375 Posts
This is from the settlement agreement-cut and dry:
LIFETIME EXTENDED WARRANTY
Owners of these vehicles will get a lifetime extended warranty on the affected components for damage related to this condition. This warranty will go into effect upon the Knock Sensor Detection System software update. Loaner vehicles may be available for owners while their vehicles are being repaired under this warranty. If a loaner vehicle is not available, the manufacturer may reimburse up to $40 per day for transportation expenses.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I just found something that I think could help me get this covered. Do any of you mind having a look at this pdf linked below? Would I be silly to take this to the dealership to help get my work approved under warranty?

Update is that I have gotten no update from Kia dealership or corporate and I don’t expect to for a couple of days. I will keep you all posted as the situation progresses.

https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2019/MC-10159235-0001.pdf
 

·
Registered
2014 Kia Optima Ex
Joined
·
55 Posts
Hello, I was until this last Sunday a proud owner of a 2013 Kia Optima SXL.

On Sunday the engine seized suddenly while on the highway and I am left with a $7500 quote for a needed engine replacement and a dealership that says the issue isn’t covered by the settlements Lifetime warranty because the engine is not “knocking” and the code P1326 is not showing up.

I had the car towed to the dealership which I usually get service done at on Sunday, and they were not able to give me a diagnosis until Tuesday (yesterday). I have not been to the dealership yet because my work shift starts and ends outside of their business hours. I have not even seen the paperwork from the diagnosis, even though I requested it be emailed to me.

The explanation I got over the phone for what happened was: “a misfire breaking away at the value.”

I don’t know what this means. I also do not understand why engine seizure would not be covered but “knocking“ would be covered.

I am attaching a photo of the settlements description of the warranty. Can anyone illuminate this situation for me? Am I covered?

I spoke to Kia Corporate to ask for good will assurance. I am not optimistic that they are even interested in paying for this.

Background info: I am the only owner, I’ve never skipped maintenance in any fashion and I have only completed maintenance at the dealership. Less than 9 weeks ago I replaced the timing belt and spark plugs.

I have a 2013 Kia Optima SXL with130,009 miles.

I feel so stressed because this is my only car and I am pregnant this is a huge burden and challenge I was not expecting. Any insight will be so helpful, thanks in advance.

Link to the info I posted: Kia Engine Settlement

View attachment 249648
It seems ever since the settlement came out Kia does not want to replace any engines. Just last year they were replacing engines for excessive oil consumption as well as the bearing issue and now they seem to come up with every excuse in the book not to. Shame on them...
 

·
Registered
2013 Kia Optima SXL
Joined
·
13 Posts
Hello, I was until this last Sunday a proud owner of a 2013 Kia Optima SXL.

On Sunday the engine seized suddenly while on the highway and I am left with a $7500 quote for a needed engine replacement and a dealership that says the issue isn’t covered by the settlements Lifetime warranty because the engine is not “knocking” and the code P1326 is not showing up.

I had the car towed to the dealership which I usually get service done at on Sunday, and they were not able to give me a diagnosis until Tuesday (yesterday). I have not been to the dealership yet because my work shift starts and ends outside of their business hours. I have not even seen the paperwork from the diagnosis, even though I requested it be emailed to me.

The explanation I got over the phone for what happened was: “a misfire breaking away at the value.”

I don’t know what this means. I also do not understand why engine seizure would not be covered but “knocking“ would be covered.

I am attaching a photo of the settlements description of the warranty. Can anyone illuminate this situation for me? Am I covered?

I spoke to Kia Corporate to ask for good will assurance. I am not optimistic that they are even interested in paying for this.

Background info: I am the only owner, I’ve never skipped maintenance in any fashion and I have only completed maintenance at the dealership. Less than 9 weeks ago I replaced the timing belt and spark plugs.

I have a 2013 Kia Optima SXL with130,009 miles.

I feel so stressed because this is my only car and I am pregnant this is a huge burden and challenge I was not expecting. Any insight will be so helpful, thanks in advance.

Link to the info I posted: Kia Engine Settlement

View attachment 249648
Hi Brianna thanks so much for making this post. I'm going through the EXACT same issue. I have a 2013 Kia Optima SXL with 118k miles. Completed 100% of maintenance at the dealership which I HOPE will be in my benefit. Also had the KSDS software update done in a timely fashion.

Background: On Dec 28 my car broke down in WV. I towed it back to the dealership (in Pittsburgh) who, jointly with KIA, has run me through the ringer on possible troubleshoot issues (see other post I made for details if you're interested). At first the dealership gave me a list of codes that we were going to chase, including changing spark plugs that were damaged (1 damaged, but we replaced all 4), checking the turbo (which looked great) and now is landed on needing a new piston. The car was in complete engine failure, knocking shaking and ultimately turning off completely (no electrical at all). The dealership tested the sparkplugs by driving 1/4 mile down the road and the car repeated the failure. The engine was also down 1.5 qt of oil only 1000mi into the oil change. There's something major wrong but the car STILL isn't throwing the 1326 code that they "need" to see. But according to your NHTSA link you posted (attached), it doesn't look like we need the 1326 code, we just need approval?

I've been through a call and wait call and wait standoff with Kia herself, probably 10-15 calls at this point, for them to escalate the issue for a "goodwill gesture" which, I found out today, was denied. This was presented as the only option to me from Kia, after telling me that the recall route was a no-go. From what I'm seeing in this thread, we have a case (?)... just gonna require some serious fighting. Doesn't help that the Kia Service Reps aren't really making in-person stops to the dealerships to verify due to COVID (that's what the service mgr told me anyways).

With the backing found in this thread, I composed an email demanding clarification... hopefully they'll have something more eloquent than "no".
 

Attachments

·
Registered
2011 Kia Optima
Joined
·
3,375 Posts
Hi Brianna thanks so much for making this post. I'm going through the EXACT same issue. I have a 2013 Kia Optima SXL with 118k miles. Completed 100% of maintenance at the dealership which I HOPE will be in my benefit. Also had the KSDS software update done in a timely fashion.

Background: On Dec 28 my car broke down in WV. I towed it back to the dealership (in Pittsburgh) who, jointly with KIA, has run me through the ringer on possible troubleshoot issues (see other post I made for details if you're interested). At first the dealership gave me a list of codes that we were going to chase, including changing spark plugs that were damaged (1 damaged, but we replaced all 4), checking the turbo (which looked great) and now is landed on needing a new piston. The car was in complete engine failure, knocking shaking and ultimately turning off completely (no electrical at all). The dealership tested the sparkplugs by driving 1/4 mile down the road and the car repeated the failure. The engine was also down 1.5 qt of oil only 1000mi into the oil change. There's something major wrong but the car STILL isn't throwing the 1326 code that they "need" to see. But according to your NHTSA link you posted (attached), it doesn't look like we need the 1326 code, we just need approval?

I've been through a call and wait call and wait standoff with Kia herself, probably 10-15 calls at this point, for them to escalate the issue for a "goodwill gesture" which, I found out today, was denied. This was presented as the only option to me from Kia, after telling me that the recall route was a no-go. From what I'm seeing in this thread, we have a case (?)... just gonna require some serious fighting. Doesn't help that the Kia Service Reps aren't really making in-person stops to the dealerships to verify due to COVID (that's what the service mgr told me anyways).

With the backing found in this thread, I composed an email demanding clarification... hopefully they'll have something more eloquent than "no".
Sorry to say, this particular problem is unlike and engine seizure as a piston was damaged probably by the spark plug, and should be glad the turbo wasn't damaged. There have been quite a few that have had spark plugs break and do considerable damage, and not all engine problems will fall under the extended warranty, only bearing problems.

Brianna's case is the ideal example of a warranty claim as the engine is seized, probably bearing degradation which should be a cut and dried case.

Good luck to you, but believe it will be an uphill battle with no positive ending.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Sorry to say, this particular problem is unlike and engine seizure as a piston was damaged probably by the spark plug, and should be glad the turbo wasn't damaged. There have been quite a few that have had spark plugs break and do considerable damage, and not all engine problems will fall under the extended warranty, only bearing problems.

Brianna's case is the ideal example of a warranty claim as the engine is seized, probably bearing degradation which should be a cut and dried case.

Good luck to you, but believe it will be an uphill battle with no positive ending.
I am glad you both posted here. I got to get face to face at the dealership finally, and they explained that what I experienced was a engine STALLING, NOT SEIZING.

They explained that since my car will start up, my engine is not seized. This makes since in retrospect, but at the time of the incident I really didn’t understand the difference between the a seized or stalled engine, especially considering what I felt seemed like the engine just had no power anymore.

Their initial description of the problem was “a misfire breaking away at the valve, and no code or knocking.” So @BLKoptimaSXL, we may be having the same problem. The mechanics you have may be taking the time to explain it to you more in depth than for me. Admittedly, I haven’t been available at the dealership because I work 60 hours a week currently.

Unfortunately, I do not think my engine will not be covered by the warranty. Since I just had spark plugs replaced 9 weeks prior, I will ask if it was done properly and if they could have been faulty. If that leads nowhere, I don’t see that I have other options to get help with the repair.

I am not sure what I will do if thats the case. I got a quote to scrap the car for $3025. I may try to sell it.

I do know I will not be paying $7500 to replace an engine in a car thats valued at around $7000. That just seems like bad investing to me.

Its devastating. I am still waiting to hear from the goodwill assurance coverage but I assume it will too be denied. Luckily I believe the lawsuit will allow you to claim a payment for losing faith in your vehicle, which we may both still be able to do.


This is from the settlement agreement-cut and dry:
LIFETIME EXTENDED WARRANTY
Owners of these vehicles will get a lifetime extended warranty on the affected components for damage related to this condition. This warranty will go into effect upon the Knock Sensor Detection System software update. Loaner vehicles may be available for owners while their vehicles are being repaired under this warranty. If a loaner vehicle is not available, the manufacturer may reimburse up to $40 per day for transportation expenses.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I expect to hear form the dealership and Kia corporate by the end of the week. I will update you all and include any details that I get. Thank you all for sharing your experience and guidance. It has been a comfort in a lousy time.
 

·
Registered
2013 Kia Optima SXL
Joined
·
13 Posts
My advice is to get anything you can in writing, from both Kia and the dealership... Service records, denial of support, out of pocket expenses (if you go the replacement route). Just my opinion, you could look into replacing parts instead of wholesale engine replacement. I'm not sure what they say is actually physically wrong with the engine in your case but that way you still have a chance that the engine recall will come into effect sometime down the line. Also hold on to your recipts! Always a chance that they extend the recall to include other issues and you may even get a refund. I made a call to the NHTSA to start a case and while they don't have alot of pull, they can start to build a case for kia to pony up. Good luck to us both but not holding my breath, just fixing one issue at a time!
 

·
Registered
2011 Kia Optima
Joined
·
3,375 Posts
Its devastating. I am still waiting to hear from the goodwill assurance coverage but I assume it will too be denied. Luckily I believe the lawsuit will allow you to claim a payment for losing faith in your vehicle, which we may both still be able to do.
Now seeing that the engine is not seized, just a major engine problem, I can see why they are being combative. Seems as though there have been a rash of major engine problems, not related to the bearing/oil issue.

Don't have any encouraging words, but rather than spend $7500, take a look at some alternatives:
used engines @ $2500 + installation. Engine warranty, but if bad they won't cover labor unless done at the selling yard.
remanufaured @ $4,000 + installation and some come with a 1 year engine & labor warranty

Haven't asked before boy or girl?

Good luck and keep us informed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Oh boy, its even more expensive than I expected! I’m attaching the estimate for what the dealership said needs to be done.

I couldn’t get any additional information about what could have caused this, they said they would have to do a tear down of the engine to know for sure what is going on.

The only details that they said could be a factor was that the spark plugs were replaced right on time. But they even said that they didn’t expect that to be the cause.

In my defense, I always ask at the dealership if I am due for any scheduled maintenance ( I am by no means a car expert and I don’t pretend to be one, so I always ask for guidance). The spark plug schedule some how slipped through the cracks - probably because I visit two dealerships based on who’s got appointments open and they don’t seem to communicate records as seamlessly as I thought they did.

The service representative said they are awaiting an answer from Kia and expect one today or tomorrow. I am still in the meantime paying for a rental car.

I think Turbonut was asking if the baby is a boy or girl, but we don’t know just yet! Hoping to find out in the next month.

If anyone else is experiencing difficulty with a major loss or repair cost like this I’d like to say one thing that helps me is just thinking of all the things I am grateful for. These cars are disappointing to lose but they are just machines. As long as we have our family and our health, we have the things that can never be replaced. I certainly hold my partner and my son just a little tighter after this experience when I get the chance.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
2013 Kia Optima SXL
Joined
·
13 Posts
Oh boy, its even more expensive than I expected! I’m attaching the estimate for what the dealership said needs to be done.

I couldn’t get any additional information about what could have caused this, they said they would have to do a tear down of the engine to know for sure what is going on.

The only details that they said could be a factor was that the spark plugs were replaced right on time. But they even said that they didn’t expect that to be the cause.

In my defense, I always ask at the dealership if I am due for any scheduled maintenance ( I am by no means a car expert and I don’t pretend to be one, so I always ask for guidance). The spark plug schedule some how slipped through the cracks - probably because I visit two dealerships based on who’s got appointments open and they don’t seem to communicate records as seamlessly as I thought they did.

The service representative said they are awaiting an answer from Kia and expect one today or tomorrow. I am still in the meantime paying for a rental car.

I think Turbonut was asking if the baby is a boy or girl, but we don’t know just yet! Hoping to find out in the next month.

If anyone else is experiencing difficulty with a major loss or repair cost like this I’d like to say one thing that helps me is just thinking of all the things I am grateful for. These cars are disappointing to lose but they are just machines. As long as we have our family and our health, we have the things that can never be replaced. I certainly hold my partner and my son just a little tighter after this experience when I get the chance.
Did they give you a list of codes that the car is throwing? Would love to see that info. In my situation (could be very different from yours) I am not interested in paying for a replacement outright BECAUSE I want the recall to come into effect at some point. If they replace the engine on my dime, I have no chance of the kia replacement. Just replacing piece by piece. Again could not be the right move for you, but just my two cents. Would hate to see you spend that much money for nothing! Def would like to see those codes tho, and it's your prerogative to have that info and not just blindly trust the dealership!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Yeah, you’re right, I’d love to see the codes too. I will see if I can get them soon and I will absolutely post when I do get my hands on them.

I honestly will just scrap it or sell it for parts if they won‘t pay to fix it. I am not about to invest nearly 10K into a car thats already valued less than that. They have suggested looking into a trade in - however I do not want to ever own a KIA again so I don’t see that shaking out.

They can’t even guarantee this wouldn’t happen again anyways because they don’t know what caused this.

“Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.”
 

·
Registered
2011 Kia Optima
Joined
·
3,375 Posts
BLKoptimaSXL:
Code or no codes, the engine doesn't show the characterisrics of bearing degradation from cylinder wall debris, so I still say you're out of luck.

BriannaKiaOptima2013:
Too bad you're in CA about 3000 miles from me, so can't be of much help.
I'd forget about the ridiculous price for the cabin filter and brake job, but look for a used engine.
One in Huntington Beach, 29000 miles, $2199, no turbo engine only or San Diego, 67000 miles with turbo, $2200, Fontana 25000 miles $2250 complete. Some yards do installations, but if not they would know a shop that does. Not a big job, maybe 8-10 hours, they drop the entire subframe, engine, tires, axles, etc all together. Labor gestimate $800-$1000.
 
1 - 20 of 39 Posts
Top