Kia Optima Forums banner
1 - 20 of 31 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
What's with their small oil filters? Is there filtering ability or lack of filtering ability causing engine failures?
 

·
Registered
2011 Kia Optima
Joined
·
3,574 Posts
No to above. Wish it was as simple as changing the oil filter, but the oil filter has nothing to do with the crappy engineering Hyundai/Kia has done with the GDI engine.
Drive it and just wait for the oil burning or engine failure if you're one of the 10-15% affected.
 

·
Registered
2012 Black SX Prem. & Tech.
Joined
·
2,289 Posts
mooney201 are you used to another kind of filter, like something from a big truck? The optima filter size seems normal to me?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
mooney201 are you used to another kind of filter, like something from a big truck? The optima filter size seems normal to me?
Ford FE filters, Ford Explorer filters, Jeep filters, Corvette filters, Ford Diesel filters, I have had many vehicles in my lifetime, and none were as low capacity as our Kia.
The only vehicle that we have owned that is close to the Kia is from a 300zx turbo we once had.

Year Vehicle Color Trans Doors Engine

1948 Plymouth Blue S 2 6
1950 Dodge Tan A 2 6
1950 Ford Red S 2 8
1955 Chevy Grn/Wht A 4 8 265
1957 Buick Yellow A/S 2 8 365
1960 Falcon White S 2 6 144
1958 Ford wagon Blu/Wht S 2 8 352
1957 Fairlane Tan A 2 8 312
1966 Fairlane Green S 2 8 390/427/428
1959 T-Bird Red A 2 8 352/390
1965 Malibu Blue S 2 8 327/350
1970 Mustang Black S 2 8 428SCJ
1969 F100 Maroon S 2 8 360/428/390
1977 Granada White A 2 8 302
1965 Ford Wagon Green A 4 8 289
1969 Fairlane Red A 2 8 428
1964 VW Or/Blk S 2 4 1200cc
1960 Falcon Green S/A 2 8 428SCJ/511
1984 300ZX Blue S 2 6 3000cc
1973 240Z Yellow S 2 6 2400cc
1978 280Z Blue S 2 6 2800cc
1974 260Z Red A 2 8 350
1984 T-Bird Brown A 2 8 302
1984 Firebird Blue A 2 8 305
1973 F250 Blu/Wht A 2 8 360/428
1997 Explorer Green A 4 6 4.0
1993 F350 Grey S 2 8 7.3 Diesel
2007 Focus Grey A 4 4 121
2002 Corvette Black S 2 8 350 LS1 s/c
2012 F250 Grey A 4 8 6.7 Diesel
2014 Jeep Grey A 4 6 3.6 Liter
2019 Kia Silver A 4 6 2.4 Liter
 

·
Registered
2011 Kia Optima
Joined
·
3,574 Posts
If you think Kia filters are small, look at Mazda filters.
Kia 3.14" height 3.02" width
Mazda 2.59" height 2.7" width and these were used throughout all the models, as well as many other car manufacturers.

Don't believe the filter would be a problem when changed as scheduled and the only benefit of a larger filter would be the minuscule amount of additional oil that could be added due to a larger filter.

If you have time, take some oil filters apart and you'll find that some larger oil filters, size wise, will have less filter media than smaller filters. Have done this years ago with probably a dozen different filters and had them lined up on a shelf for quite some time, but like most items, to the trash they went.

Maybe you can locate a larger filter as the dimensions:
Gasket ID 2.13/2.15
Gasket OD 2.42/2.46
Thread M 20X1.5
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Most of my filters holds close to one quart of oil. Some like my diesel truck are over one quart. Our Kia Filter held a very small amount of oil, and I took my time filling it to make sure I got as much oil in it as I could.
Because of the plastic cover, I am not sure how much larger a filter could be, and still fit.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
If you think Kia filters are small, look at Mazda filters.
Kia 3.14" height 3.02" width
Mazda 2.59" height 2.7" width and these were used throughout all the models, as well as many other car manufacturers.

Don't believe the filter would be a problem when changed as scheduled and the only benefit of a larger filter would be the minuscule amount of additional oil that could be added due to a larger filter.

If you have time, take some oil filters apart and you'll find that some larger oil filters, size wise, will have less filter media than smaller filters. Have done this years ago with probably a dozen different filters and had them lined up on a shelf for quite some time, but like most items, to the trash they went.

Maybe you can locate a larger filter as the dimensions:
Gasket ID 2.13/2.15
Gasket OD 2.42/2.46
Thread M 20X1.5
Yes over the years I have cut filters to see the media of different brands of filters. Baldwin and Wix were at that time using better filter material and more of it.
 

·
Registered
2018 Kia Optima
Joined
·
1,164 Posts
Slightly off-topic--back in the day the Mobil-1 oil filter I used for the first half-dozen years or so on my 2004 GMC Yukon was of a particular size; then sometime after that (I don't know exactly when it changed) M-1 started to specify a different--and smaller-sized--oil filter for my exact model year and make. No idea why as to the downsizing but luckily for me the M-1 guidebook still referenced the older oil filter p/n that could still be used on previous-year models.
 

·
Registered
2018 kia optima LX
Joined
·
44 Posts
modern vehicles have smaller oil filters!! girlfriends 18 optima 2.4L filter is bigger than my 2011 frontier 4.0 filter. change oil + filter as directed in the owners manual!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
The smaller the oil filter the less contaminates it will hold. I change oil at 3,000 miles on most of our cars, but because the Kia has contaminate issues, I first changed our oil at 1,000 miles and the last one was at 2,000 miles. I will extend that out to 3,000 miles for the next oil change. So when the odometer shows 5,000 miles I will do our third oil change. We are at 2,100 miles now.
 

·
Registered
2011 Kia Optima
Joined
·
3,574 Posts
The smaller the oil filter the less contaminates it will hold. I change oil at 3,000 miles on most of our cars, but because the Kia has contaminate issues, I first changed our oil at 1,000 miles and the last one was at 2,000 miles. I will extend that out to 3,000 miles for the next oil change. So when the odometer shows 5,000 miles I will do our third oil change. We are at 2,100 miles now.
Changing oil at those intervals, waste of time and money. First, there's not enough contaminates in the oil to fill the filter and the engine issue is not from debris. Think about the term they use and then review engine failures from 7,000 to 200,000 miles, doesn't make sense and I believe it's a structural issue with the GDI engine. Just had the engine replaced in our '11 EX 2.0T with 172,000 miles, ran and performed perfectly except that during the oil consumption test, 2 qts 730 miles.

Stay with the factory oil change intervals.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Changing oil at those intervals, waste of time and money. First, there's not enough contaminates in the oil to fill the filter and the engine issue is not from debris. Think about the term they use and then review engine failures from 7,000 to 200,000 miles, doesn't make sense and I believe it's a structural issue with the GDI engine. Just had the engine replaced in our '11 EX 2.0T with 172,000 miles, ran and performed perfectly except that during the oil consumption test, 2 qts 730 miles.

Stay with the factory oil change intervals.
I don't agree with you. I heard that some of the problems of Kia engine failures were do to contaminates from the factory where they built the engines. I have been building engines since the 1960's and have always made the first engine oil change at 1,000 miles on street engines and just after break in period on race engines and I always kept a spotless engine room. I have had only one engine failure and that was due to to a nitrous oxide solenoid failure on a race engine.
 

·
Registered
2011 Kia Optima
Joined
·
3,574 Posts
I don't agree with you. I heard that some of the problems of Kia engine failures were do to contaminates from the factory where they built the engines. I have been building engines since the 1960's and have always made the first engine oil change at 1,000 miles on street engines and just after break in period on race engines and I always kept a spotless engine room. I have had only one engine failure and that was due to to a nitrous oxide solenoid failure on a race engine.
Here's my answer to you, similar to my above response.
Having also built many engines I totally agree with the cleanliness needed, however if one would leave debris in the engine when it was assembled, it sure isn't going to be the cause of engine failures at 7,000 miles and at 190,000 miles. If debris were the cause, and there had to be a great amount, it would happen in a very short period of time. Look at the plastic gears used on cam gears many years ago, when they started to disintegrate the gear was replaced and people didn't clean out the sump, the engine was starved of oil and came to a halt in a very short period of time.

The "debris" problem also is the cause for high oil consumption in the recalled years and engines have been replaced because of that problem, and that's not from debris, I say it's because of cylinder distortion. Once again, as posted above, just had mine replaced, 2011 2.0T, with 172,000 miles, 2 qts. 730 miles. Now I don't understand how a debris issue doesn't cause the engine bearing to seize, but is the cause of high oil consumption, and this has been the cause for many engine replacements.

Take at look at williamhood's posts, meticulous maintenance, best oil, short changes, engine gone at 72,000 miles.

Bottom line, it certainly isn't going to hurt anything but time and pocketbook to change the oil at 1,000 mile intervals, but it isn't going to inhibit the demise of the engine if it's destined to commit suicide.
 

·
Registered
2012 Black SX Prem. & Tech.
Joined
·
2,289 Posts
I think there is a confusion about how the problem with Kia engine failures was from restricted/clogged oil passages, because there was contamination in them from manufacturing that would never have gotten in there during normal operation.

There is nothing you can do to affect that clogging of the engine passages, because it's a problem with the tiny passages and not the oil filter. You can change the oil and filter every single day, but that won't affect the clogged passages or remove the contaminants from the tiny passages. It's just trapped in there from when the engine was made.

Any oil filter is capable of holding a crap-load of contaminants. But I don't see the value of aggressive oil/filter changes. It's not going to hurt the car but it will hurt your wallet and your free time.

I think the main concern about oil changes is the change in viscosity of the oil, especially if you are using the turbo a lot and excessively heating the oil a lot.

If you are concerned about accumulating lots of contaminants, maybe you should look at what you think is falling apart in the engine and fix that? Or do an oil quality test to see how many contaminants are actually there, so you can rest at ease and not just make your decisions based on fear or speculation without any evidence.
 

·
Registered
2018 Kia Optima
Joined
·
1,164 Posts
But I don't see the value of aggressive oil/filter changes. It's not going to hurt the car but it will hurt your wallet and your free time.
To be fair, for all we know he may have a very fat wallet and/or plenty of free time; that and/or maybe he has shares in petroleum product companies--LOL j/k. He did state that his next oil change will be at 5K miles, after which I presume his OCI from that point forward will be every 5K miles, at least for that vehicle; nothing wrong with 5K mile OCIs, as it's not too excessive or too long an interval.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
104 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
To be fair, for all we know he may have a very fat wallet and/or plenty of free time; that and/or maybe he has shares in petroleum product companies--LOL j/k. He did state that his next oil change will be at 5K miles, after which I presume his OCI from that point forward will be every 5K miles, at least for that vehicle; nothing wrong with 5K mile OCIs, as it's not too excessive or too long an interval.
Yes, like I said, the SMART thing to do is to make the first oil change early if there is any possibility of oil contamination from the factory. Then change at normal intervals.
Damage that can occur at an earlier time and then show up as a melt down later on happens.
If Turbo Nut took the time to read and understand my post, he would understand that I did an early oil change to remove any contaminants, and then will go to standard oil changes at 5000 miles. It has nothing to do with deep pockets, just common sense and years of experience.
I think there is a confusion about how the problem with Kia engine failures was from restricted/clogged oil passages, because there was contamination in them from manufacturing that would never have gotten in there during normal operation.

There is nothing you can do to affect that clogging of the engine passages, because it's a problem with the tiny passages and not the oil filter. You can change the oil and filter every single day, but that won't affect the clogged passages or remove the contaminants from the tiny passages. It's just trapped in there from when the engine was made.

Any oil filter is capable of holding a crap-load of contaminants. But I don't see the value of aggressive oil/filter changes. It's not going to hurt the car but it will hurt your wallet and your free time.

I think the main concern about oil changes is the change in viscosity of the oil, especially if you are using the turbo a lot and excessively heating the oil a lot.

If you are concerned about accumulating lots of contaminants, maybe you should look at what you think is falling apart in the engine and fix that? Or do an oil quality test to see how many contaminants are actually there, so you can rest at ease and not just make your decisions based on fear or speculation without any evidence.
Obviously you can't read either.
 

·
Registered
2012 Black SX Prem. & Tech.
Joined
·
2,289 Posts
No, I think that 3000 mile interval for oil change is aggressive and waste of money.

Also I think that post suggests that you'd want to change oil early because of the Kia engine contamination, and my point is that wouldn't help with the particular Kia issue.
 
1 - 20 of 31 Posts
Top