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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
The car has 80K miles on it and the long block was replaced under their recall a few years back so it is fairly new. I do NOT know if they replaced the turbo or not but I assume they did not. 100% stock car. What I'm noticing is a significant lack of power and i can hear the turbo moving air and whistling which I never had before. At first I thought I had an intake tube on the boost side come lose but I pulled all the tubing to check and all was well. I disconnected the wastegate rod from the control motor and ensured it moved, it freely moved. I also ensured the blowoff/discharge valve moved and held when vacuum was applied. I am getting no CEL at this point which I do find odd as you'd think it'd monitor boost via MAP sensor? I have no codes, no pending codes. I had read people had similar issues and it was the PCM but I have a hard time believing that is my problem here. I'm going to have to see if there is a way I can monitor a boost and wastegate PID in realtime I think to see if i'm actually on the right track. With that said does anyone have any service data on this car, manual etc? I want to bench test the wastegate motor and also the blowoff solenoid although that would result in more boost I would imagine if it stuck shut. Any input would be greatly appreciated. I do have it on the lift and checked the bottom side of the turbo and all is secure. It's very hard to see the hot side of the turbo from head to turbo but given i hear the turbo spinning I feel that isn't it and I certainly don't seem to hear any exhaust leaks anyway.

I just remembered i had an ELM327 and torque so I went for a little drive and sure enough, no boost (See pic below). No idea what PID load is referencing and no idea why it's only at 50%. Also see TPS never gets above 85% but that doesn't bother me too much. I also noticed it seems to be slow revving right at idle.. I've never been much of a turbo guy so I'm not entirely sure what this means. I am hearing the turbo spool for sure which I never have before. I wonder if the wastegate is the problem. If it was you'd think it'd throw a code no?
Watch Font Speedometer Window Circle


Thanks much,

Dave
 

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C'mon Kia, do better than the Chinese junk please!! I would have never thought to look at the endcaps of intercooler had others not had this same issue. This is pretty pathetic of Kia.
Glad you posted the problem and fix with a quick diagnosis.
Yup, you're not the first, and hard to believe these intercoolers commit suicide quite often, but as you stated,
it's a Kia/Hyundai.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Glad you posted the problem and fix with a quick diagnosis.
Yup, you're not the first, and hard to believe these intercoolers commit suicide quite often, but as you stated,
it's a Kia/Hyundai.
In defense of Kia/Hyundai their build quality is quite good. I have had kia's/hyundais since 2001 and not one has ever left me stranded. I've been a car guy for 25+ years now and have had every sort of car from luxury to sports car you could imagine and it's not a bad car. Granted my 13 optima SXL cost me over 40K back in 13 so it certainly should be expected to be of decent build quality. I can tell you the interior build quality is better than my vette.

Dave
 

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In defense of Kia/Hyundai their build quality is quite good. I have had kia's/hyundais since 2001 and not one has ever left me stranded. I've been a car guy for 25+ years now and have had every sort of car from luxury to sports car you could imagine and it's not a bad car. Granted my 13 optima SXL cost me over 40K back in 13 so it certainly should be expected to be of decent build quality. I can tell you the interior build quality is better than my vette.

Dave
Must have an old Vette. Our '89 RX7 Turbo, we purchased new, along with the wile's old '04 Acura TL puts the Kia interior to shame. Also, got to disagree on quality, that's a word that Hyundai/Kia seems to forget. Our '08 Optima 2.4 was stellar, 298,000 miles, no drivetrain problems at all, no A/C problems, no suspension problems, ride was great, but now let's look at the crappy '11 2.0T. Along with the aforementioned problems, it rides like a truck, actually our F150 4x4 rides better, crappy what they call leather, but just one item is all we need to know about in the Kia/Hyundai line up, the horrendous DGI engine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Must have an old Vette. Our '89 RX7 Turbo, we purchased new, along with the wile's old '04 Acura TL puts the Kia interior to shame. Also, got to disagree on quality, that's a word that Hyundai/Kia seems to forget. Our '08 Optima 2.4 was stellar, 298,000 miles, no drivetrain problems at all, no A/C problems, no suspension problems, ride was great, but now let's look at the crappy '11 2.0T. Along with the aforementioned problems, it rides like a truck, actually our F150 4x4 rides better, crappy what they call leather, but just one item is all we need to know about in the Kia/Hyundai line up, the horrendous DGI engine.
Not old. I also had an FD RX7 and the interior was some of the cheapest plastics I've seen and they were notorious for breaking. I've had every panel off of that car also. You cannot really compare an Acura TL. That's like comparing my luxury Lexus to a Kia, two different target markets/price points. People don't realize the reasoning behind ride issues. Suspension tuning/rates, lower aspect tires, etc. all affect ride significantly. I use a 17" tire in the winter and the ride is significantly better due to the taller sidewall. Remember certain kia models have a sport tuned suspension which is inherently stiffer (Spring rate, shock valving, etc. al). I did a bunch of racing and have spent significant time in chassis tuning/dynamics and know first hand what each little change does to handling/ride/NVH. Mechanically the kia/hyundais have been amazing for me since the 2001 elantra w/ the 2.0L I had. Zero issues with any of them. 01 elanta, 05 elantra gt, 09 sonata 13 optima. And my family also have them, zero issues.
 

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lower aspect tires, etc. all affect ride significantly. I use a 17" tire in the winter and the ride is significantly better due to the taller sidewall. Remember certain kia models have a sport tuned suspension which is inherently stiffer (Spring rate, shock valving, etc. al).
Agreed - I noticed a difference on my 2012 SX (sport suspension) when I went with a slightly taller sidewall than stock, the ride quality improved. After that experiment, I kept re-ordering my tires with that slightly taller profile.

Current taller profile: 225/50-18

Normally it would be stock shorter profile of 225/45-18

With the taller profile you get roughly 3% larger circumference, so it's not a huge difference, but I remember how it felt "better"? I never studied how it affected fuel economy, but I'm guessing it moved the "sweet spot" cruising speed by around 3% up or down???
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
Agreed - I noticed a difference on my 2012 SX (sport suspension) when I went with a slightly taller sidewall than stock, the ride quality improved. After that experiment, I kept re-ordering my tires with that slightly taller profile.

Current taller profile: 225/50-18

Normally it would be stock shorter profile of 225/45-18

With the taller profile you get roughly 3% larger circumference, so it's not a huge difference, but I remember how it felt "better"? I never studied how it affected fuel economy, but I'm guessing it moved the "sweet spot" cruising speed by around 3% up or down???
One thing to consider when doing this is that you want to preserve your rollout (Tire diameter) or you will throw off your speedo. You can do the math to see how much your speedo is off now if you really care. In some cases w/ a staggered tire combo (Larger front/rear diameter) it'll make the stability control go crazy as it thinks the rear tires are rotating at a different rate than the front based on wheel sensor data. From the factory the vettes had a larger rear diameter than the front and it was subject to this temper tantrum. It can get scary sometimes if you are going around a corner and it applies brake pressure to the right front tire while turning right, talk about oversteer. For my Kia I kept the exact same OD/Rollout as it was just supposed to be a winter tire/rim combo. I ended up always leaving it on though because I'm lazy and I never did refinish my junk PVD coated wheels. I cannot believe that after a little more than 3 years they started to peel. Seemed to be a huge issue but Kia never did anything to rectify it.


Dave
 

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Well, I put S rated 55 series tires on the '11 and it made no difference in ride, still hard as a rock, and those tires when standing upright could be turned inside out when pushing on the tread. Also one could go to a larger sidewall, end up with a V rated XL tire and the ride would still be hard as a rock, if not harder

Also, not to be picky, but you state great cars, zero issues, but you had to have the engine replaced in the SX, and to me that's a pretty big problem. The VDC sucks, and let's not forget about the poorly designed turbo oil line that needed to be replaced, steering coupler that was junk and needed replacement, oil mix they sprayed under the cars because of excessive rust, and as I stated early, engine so bad that they give a lifetime warranty if the KSDS update has been done, just another way to give the owners the shaft, not a recall, an update.
At 224k I'm on my 4th nav unit, all rear suspension parts needed to be cut out, frozen solid, exhaust system rotted out, brake sliders terrible and even the rubber on the sliders expands and sticks, so just eliminate them, guess Kia never thought of that problem.
Terrible company, terrible product.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Well, I put S rated 55 series tires on the '11 and it made no difference in ride, still hard as a rock, and those tires when standing upright could be turned inside out when pushing on the tread. Also one could go to a larger sidewall, end up with a V rated XL tire and the ride would still be hard as a rock, if not harder

Also, not to be picky, but you state great cars, zero issues, but you had to have the engine replaced in the SX, and to me that's a pretty big problem. The VDC sucks, and let's not forget about the poorly designed turbo oil line that needed to be replaced, steering coupler that was junk and needed replacement, oil mix they sprayed under the cars because of excessive rust, and as I stated early, engine so bad that they give a lifetime warranty if the KSDS update has been done, just another way to give the owners the shaft, not a recall, an update.
At 224k I'm on my 4th nav unit, all rear suspension parts needed to be cut out, frozen solid, exhaust system rotted out, brake sliders terrible and even the rubber on the sliders expands and sticks, so just eliminate them, guess Kia never thought of that problem.
Terrible company, terrible product.
I had no issues w/ that engine. There was a recall where I believe they desensitized the knock sensors and logged for a particular frequency and if they saw it they replaced the engine. Apparently mine was one of them. Mind you, I've been racing cars for a LONG time and I know what a rod knock, lifter tick, bottom/top end noise, etc. is. My ears are attuned to it and I can hear it over anything at pretty much any point.. There was none of that out of this engine. I wasn't going to complain but I had ZERO issues with that engine before that. They were having some bottom end issues on the 2L turbo GDIs at the time I guess and issued the recall, not exactly sure of the details, it was my DD and I didn't care. They offered a loaner and a lifetime warranty on the long block so I said, swap away. A nav unit isn't even something I would complain about. That's an outsourced part that is outdated the day it hits the showroom floor and everyone should know that. You cannot blame Chevy if BOSE has an issue w/ their amps/speakers can you? Same applies for the navi IMO. So you have a rotted/rusty car w/ seize bolts and that's kia's fault? If you live in the midwest/east coast and you drive in snow/salt that's 100% typical where you are either using the liquid wrench to melt or cut off fasteners. I've been doing this a LONG time and what you are explaining is nothing kia/hyundai can prevent IMO. The one issue I take w/ hyundai is their brake lines and the way they secure them. Pretty much guarantees a rusted through brake line at some point if you live in midwest/east coast. But again most cars have same issues. Every single thing you complain about is 100% typical. Rust is an issue. If you think you have it bad watch Eric at south main auto having to cut apart cars, poke screwdrivers through rotted frames, etc. that are less than 10 years old in New York, you'll see how good you actually have it. My .02

Dave
 

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Maybe you didn't realize that Kia/Hyundai products were recalled for rotted sub-frames and rotted LCA's, junk metal, but to you 100% normal, but never had any other vehicle in the household have such serious rust problems, same house location. Maybe you ought to do more research on the crappy DGI engines. All manufactured with poor engineering, cylinder walls distort, rings wear, debris drops to oil pan, picked up through the oil pickup tube, clogs pump, no lubrication, engine seizes, junk. Bose is a sound system, similar to the Infinity in Kia, not the nav manufacturer. Incase you're not familiar with thIs system, when it goies out, nothing works, FM, Sirius/XM, so maybe you would ride around with no sound, not me.
Desensitized the knock system, just the opposite.

If you're happy with the car, that's all that counts.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Now that you mention it I do have a knock when I move wheel left/right. it sounds like it's near the column. Granted my car has 80K on it but both tie rods had to be replaced recently as well as one lower ball joint yesterday so there are a few things that could use some work. But at 80K it doesn't owe me anything. Yes, my other higher end cars haven't needed this but it's a small price to pay IMO. Perhaps that coupler you mention is my knocking issue, will look into this.


Btw, we now have all the PSI's again!!
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I hope that your replacement had welded end tanks or you had someone weld them before installation. Otherwise it’s just going to happen again. Very poorly designed and made piece.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I hope that your replacement had welded end tanks or you had someone weld them before installation. Otherwise it’s just going to happen again. Very poorly designed and made piece.
I didn't even look to be honest. I am shocked they just used a machined surface to seal and bent tabs to secure the end tanks. I was half tempted to take my old intercooler to have the tanks welded but I figured given how cheap these are it wasn't worth it. I really need to learn how to TIG.

Dave
 

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I didn't even look to be honest. I am shocked they just used a machined surface to seal and bent tabs to secure the end tanks. I was half tempted to take my old intercooler to have the tanks welded but I figured given how cheap these are it wasn't worth it. I really need to learn how to TIG.

Dave
Tig welding not the easiest thing to do especially aluminum. The replacement I got had welded tanks and was painted. The intercooler being 1 stock part i thought I’d never have to replace.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Tig welding not the easiest thing to do especially aluminum. The replacement I got had welded tanks and was painted. The intercooler being 1 stock part i thought I’d never have to replace.

Yep, same. I'm sure I could figure out TIG over time. Plan to take a class at some point. Could just get a spool for my MIG too but then I need different gas as well
 
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